Comments on: PR in politics - it’s time for journalists to make their minds up http://www.pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/ Irish Communications Consultant - Be Noticed Tue, 16 Mar 2010 20:20:12 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.2 By: Piaras http://www.pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-840 Piaras Thu, 24 Nov 2005 13:40:08 +0000 http://pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-840 Adam - I'm talking about journalists in general, rather than publications specficaly. Kudos on the very PR way to tackle the subject :D Simon - I don't think that government ministers need PR consultancies, I would say that due to demands that the media place on them, they should be media trained. Or looking at point three, civil servants that write their releases and handle other communications services should be media trained. I don't normally praise the PRII, but they regularly run one day course that they could avail of. I have to constantly educate myselves, I think the same should be required for them. Wouldn't say that without PR we wouldn't know what government was doing, but with advice they could be doing it better, i.e. offering RSS feeds, etc. Adam - I’m talking about journalists in general, rather than publications specficaly. Kudos on the very PR way to tackle the subject :D

Simon - I don’t think that government ministers need PR consultancies, I would say that due to demands that the media place on them, they should be media trained.

Or looking at point three, civil servants that write their releases and handle other communications services should be media trained. I don’t normally praise the PRII, but they regularly run one day course that they could avail of. I have to constantly educate myselves, I think the same should be required for them.

Wouldn’t say that without PR we wouldn’t know what government was doing, but with advice they could be doing it better, i.e. offering RSS feeds, etc.

]]> By: Simon McGarr http://www.pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-839 Simon McGarr Wed, 23 Nov 2005 19:20:48 +0000 http://pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-839 Sorry Piaras, I'm unpersuaded. 1. The PR people said that people who don't use PR will make mistakes like this. -Well, I refer you to Mandy Rice-Davis on that one. 2. A different paper complained about the overspend on PR consultants. -Not a direct contradiction of the Tribune. Overpend, by definition, is spending beyond that which is required. 3. Government Ministers have to run the country and don't have time to draft press releases etc. -No, but they don't need time for that. They have a Civil Service. PR consultants are an expensive duplication of already paid-for services. 4. Without PR we wouldn't know what the Government was doing. -Without PR we might know what the Government was doing. Sorry Piaras, I’m unpersuaded.
1. The PR people said that people who don’t use PR will make mistakes like this.
-Well, I refer you to Mandy Rice-Davis on that one.
2. A different paper complained about the overspend on PR consultants.
-Not a direct contradiction of the Tribune. Overpend, by definition, is spending beyond that which is required.
3. Government Ministers have to run the country and don’t have time to draft press releases etc.
-No, but they don’t need time for that. They have a Civil Service. PR consultants are an expensive duplication of already paid-for services.
4. Without PR we wouldn’t know what the Government was doing.
-Without PR we might know what the Government was doing.

]]> By: adam http://www.pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-838 adam Wed, 23 Nov 2005 19:10:35 +0000 http://pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-838 "You can’t criticise people for a lack of PR skills and then complain when they go out to hire someone to help improve them." Ah but "they" didn't. The Trib said one, the Indo the other. They may be sister newspapers, but would you criticise two sisters for having slightly differing/opposing/conflicting opinions? Of course you wouldn't. That was a very PR-like way to tackle the subject Piaras. :) “You can’t criticise people for a lack of PR skills and then complain when they go out to hire someone to help improve them.”

Ah but “they” didn’t. The Trib said one, the Indo the other. They may be sister newspapers, but would you criticise two sisters for having slightly differing/opposing/conflicting opinions? Of course you wouldn’t.

That was a very PR-like way to tackle the subject Piaras. :)

]]> By: Tom http://www.pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-837 Tom Wed, 23 Nov 2005 14:11:19 +0000 http://pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-837 "Journalists should be free to criticise PR practitioners if they’re trying to spin figures, but they have absolutely no right to complain about people whose job revolves around providing them with information they require." The problem with the above argument is that the person trying to 'spin' the figures and providing information is often the same person. Journalists dislike PR people because we make their job harder. In politics, PR people tend to protect ministers from making the kind of mistake Willie O'Dea made, so the Tribune was right in saying that he was poorly looked after, and needed better advice on what he should do. Don't forget the two killings in Dublin a day or two before the article and the 4 serious firearm incidents in Limerick the week before the image as well. However, the Indo criticized the amount spent on PR advisors probably because PR people make their job harder, making sure that incidents like the Willie O'Dea picture are too few and far between. PR people are a barrier to journalists getting access to the politicians and to the stories they want to run. The problem is that the journalists will always have the last word, and no matter how reasonsable the individual PR people are, they are still a barrier to access which the journalists resent and have free reign to attack. It's not fair, but jounalists don't have to be. “Journalists should be free to criticise PR practitioners if they’re trying to spin figures, but they have absolutely no right to complain about people whose job revolves around providing them with information they require.”

The problem with the above argument is that the person trying to ’spin’ the figures and providing information is often the same person. Journalists dislike PR people because we make their job harder. In politics, PR people tend to protect ministers from making the kind of mistake Willie O’Dea made, so the Tribune was right in saying that he was poorly looked after, and needed better advice on what he should do. Don’t forget the two killings in Dublin a day or two before the article and the 4 serious firearm incidents in Limerick the week before the image as well.

However, the Indo criticized the amount spent on PR advisors probably because PR people make their job harder, making sure that incidents like the Willie O’Dea picture are too few and far between. PR people are a barrier to journalists getting access to the politicians and to the stories they want to run.

The problem is that the journalists will always have the last word, and no matter how reasonsable the individual PR people are, they are still a barrier to access which the journalists resent and have free reign to attack. It’s not fair, but jounalists don’t have to be.

]]> By: Piaras http://www.pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-836 Piaras Wed, 23 Nov 2005 13:28:44 +0000 http://pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-836 Sorry for the late reply. Not all ministers have external PR advisors. I think only four consultancies currently advising various departments. Bertie Ahern has three media advisors, but obviously Willie O'Dea doesn't. He would have a press secretary, but just look at media savy Ahern is compared to O'Dea. Stuart Bruce has a good follow-up post on the matter and is in a much better position to comment since he's a PR blogger and a Labour councillor: http://www.20six.co.uk/stuartbruce/archive/2005/11/21/26p4e95utxkd.htm His opinion is "If the media could be trusted to report stories truthfully and without bias (spin) then the politicians wouldn't need to resort to it." Sorry for the late reply. Not all ministers have external PR advisors. I think only four consultancies currently advising various departments.

Bertie Ahern has three media advisors, but obviously Willie O’Dea doesn’t. He would have a press secretary, but just look at media savy Ahern is compared to O’Dea.

Stuart Bruce has a good follow-up post on the matter and is in a much better position to comment since he’s a PR blogger and a Labour councillor: http://www.20six.co.uk/stuartbruce/archive/2005/11/21/26p4e95utxkd.htm His opinion is “If the media could be trusted to report stories truthfully and without bias (spin) then the politicians wouldn’t need to resort to it.”

]]> By: Breffni http://www.pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-835 Breffni Tue, 22 Nov 2005 10:54:13 +0000 http://pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-835 I dunno if PR could have helped. Like most employer-employee relationships, you need a bit of give and take. What O'Dea done was so plain right dumb, no PR person could possibly of imagined he'd be that stupid. If your a personal trainer you need the person training to work just as hard when your not there, as when you are. PR and improving your skills should be no different. I dunno if PR could have helped. Like most employer-employee relationships, you need a bit of give and take. What O’Dea done was so plain right dumb, no PR person could possibly of imagined he’d be that stupid. If your a personal trainer you need the person training to work just as hard when your not there, as when you are. PR and improving your skills should be no different.

]]> By: Ed Byrne http://www.pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-834 Ed Byrne Mon, 21 Nov 2005 20:55:47 +0000 http://pkellypr.com/blog/2005/1121/pr-in-politics-its-time-for-journalists-to-make-their-minds-up/#comment-834 I think you've justed missed a bigger point there. If it's true that the government hires PR practitioners (as the Indo says) AND O'Dea made this mistake - then the issue is not whether PR people are being paid too much, or that ministers have no PR training - but rather, what is God's name ARE the goverment PR people doing if they let things like this happen? I think you’ve justed missed a bigger point there. If it’s true that the government hires PR practitioners (as the Indo says) AND O’Dea made this mistake - then the issue is not whether PR people are being paid too much, or that ministers have no PR training - but rather, what is God’s name ARE the goverment PR people doing if they let things like this happen?

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